Showing posts with label mike cosper. Show all posts
Showing posts with label mike cosper. Show all posts

Saturday, March 25, 2023

after Jake Meador's "The Therapeutic, Ctd": the sword of the therapeutic, the sword of the spirit, and how the former can be wielded by those accused of misusing the latter-exhibit A: post-Mars Hill Mark Driscoll

https://blogs.mereorthodoxy.com/jake/the-therapeutic-ctd/

Last year we raised a number of concerns about the ubiquity of therapeutic discourse within the evangelical movement.

In particular, a number of writers associated with Mere O, including myself, are alarmed by two things in particular:

  • First, the ways in which therapeutic techniques seem to be replacing Christian discipleship as the means for pursuing personal growth.
  • Second, with the ways in which categories of mental health and wellness seem to be replacing Christian maturity as the chief end of that growth.

And so when I see projects like this and language like this, well, I think my friends and I are rather vindicated in those concerns:

With the help of the Enneagram, powered by the gospel, you can experience transformation.

04. Be Transformed
And finally! You’re on your way to transforming your life and relationships.

In some sense, many of the people falling into these habits of thought have been somewhat ill-served by the church. We are now 40 years into the seeker-sensitive liturgical experiment and the results, with regards to discipleship and catechesis, have been fairly abysmal. If our churches have behaved as if “Christian discipleship” largely consists of “holding the right ideas in your head” and “consuming the right content,” then it isn’t terribly surprising that many Christians would encounter the difficulties of life and feel radically unprepared for them. Their churches didn’t teach them to expect suffering, didn’t give them models for resilience and dependence on God, and didn’t provide practical guidance in mortifying sin and offering oneself up to God. So of course we now have many Christian people who are a bit at sea, particularly given how chaotic, angry, and uncertain this cultural moment has become. In such a scenario, techniques like the enneagram have an obvious appeal.

And yet the way of imagining the Christian life as conceived by this particular sort of approach to the enneagram seems hopelessly compromised to me. For 2000 years Christians have seen transformation through the Gospel without availing themselves of the enneagram. They have endured torture, persecution, the loss of family and status, and much else besides and have done it all without the aid of modern therapeutic technique. So while I understand that the failures of the attractional model created a vacuum that therapeutic technique has rushed in to fill, I also know that the cost of allowing therapeutic technique to persist in this work is far too high.

What is that cost, exactly? The cost is that the people of God would forget how to understand themselves using the language that the people of God have always used. ...

[5:07 pm, date of publication--I just got this idea that Meador may want to, if he hasn't already, go through Ephraim Radner's A Profound Ignorance for the trajectory of how Christianity in the West dropped talk of martyrdom and discipleship in favor of personal triumph over adversity via pneumatology. Nobody in the post-seeker-sensitive milieu may embody the doctrinal and ethical vices of what Radner called the "pneumatic man" quite like the guy who used to head up a megachurch here in Seattle since he bailed on Seattle, but I"m getting ahead of myself after the fact]


Having gone my whole life until a year or so ago having never heard of the Enneagram I have to admit that it’s a challenge to understand what people use it for and why Christian writers would balk at what sounds like a variation on the Meyers Briggs Temperament Index which itself was openly indebted to the four temperaments of Hellenistic speculative thought and philosophy.  The point I'm going to make will, as usual for me, take a while, and it springs off of some of Meador's concerns.

Sunday, September 04, 2022

Keith Evans via Heidelblog on the appeal of wolfish leaders (Doug Wilson and Mark Driscoll in particular as examples of trends)

R. Scott Clark at Heidelblog republished a piece by Keith Evans recently that discussed Mike Cosper's The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill and the appeal of wolfish leaders in churches.

Evans published his piece on August 23, 2022 which meant he could not have heard the entire series as Mike Cosper and company dropped their Dan Allender episode in the series ...
... on August 26, 2022 and there's assuredly one last wrap-up "where are they now" episode coming along.


I thought the CT series was going to actually be done with Episode 12 ("Aftermath") and yet here we are nearly a year later and the truly final episode has not yet hit.  So it goes.  

Wednesday, August 31, 2022

the theme at Mark Driscoll's twitter feed this week is fear (update 9-4-22, toward a proposal that the Driscolls now use forgiveness teaching as a form of apotropaic magic)

Although he's known to block any number of people on Twitter from viewing or responding to his tweets, the fact that Wenatchee The Hatchet isn't even on Twitter and never plans to be means, paradoxically, that it's never been that hard to keep tabs on his tweets.

For whatever reason, since the August 26, 2022 Mike Cosper interview with Dan Allender in The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill series came along ...
...Mark Driscoll's tweets are full of talk about fear.

https://twitter.com/PastorMark/status/1563601993246990336
Pastor Mark Driscoll
@PastorMark
Fear will come upon you, but you can't let it in you.
11:59 AM · Aug 27, 2022

https://twitter.com/PastorMark/status/1563964381196652545
Pastor Mark Driscoll
@PastorMark
There’s always something to fear. You can look out in fear or look up in faith.
11:59 AM · Aug 28, 2022

https://twitter.com/PastorMark/status/1564327027188056066
Pastor Mark Driscoll
@PastorMark
Faith and fear can't coexist.
12:00 PM · Aug 29, 2022·

https://twitter.com/PastorMark/status/1564689660672184323
Sometimes fear does more damage to you than the person or thing you're afraid of.
12:01 PM · Aug 30, 2022

https://twitter.com/PastorMark/status/1565052048160264193
When the spirit of fear oppress you it turns into false prophecy over your life.
12:01 PM · Aug 31, 2022

Other people can do the screencap thing if they like.  

POSTSCRIPT ... 9-1-2022
Still running with the theme as of 

https://twitter.com/PastorMark/status/1565414436038479872
You need to stop worrying about the outcome and instead worship through the process.
12:01 PM · Sep 1, 2022

POSTSCRIPT 9-4-2022

https://twitter.com/PastorMark/status/1566501851457019904
Forgiving others allows us to move on into the destiny that God has for us.
12:02 PM · Sep 4, 2022

In his post Mars Hill writings Driscoll has leaned heavily on a teaching that says we(you) need to forgive people in order to be free of demonic influence and that if you don't forgive you are saying you want Satan instead of Jesus to reign in your life. It's an idea he had back in 2008, too, for that matter but within a post-Mars Hill context via Win Your War and tweets there's a different element to it.  Some Christians approach spiritual warfare as a set of instructions about how Christians corporately and publicly give witness to the reign of Christ as having already conquered the powers and principalities.  This shows up in books by Esther Acolatse, Daniel K Darko, Robert Ewusie Moses and other pastors and theologians from Ghana and Kenya.  Acolatse has noted that in some African church movements there is a tendency for Christians to treat spiritual warfare as a kind of medicinal individual one-shot deal. Another way to put it, since I've seen this pattern in my life back in my Pentecostal days is that there are a lot of Christians who regard spiritual warfare instructions in Ephesians 6 not as instructions for how Christian communities bear public witness to Christ together so much as a kind of anti-magic that is paradoxically magical.  

In Driscoll's post-Mars Hill variant on teaching about the need for Christians to forgive it's hard for me to shake a sense that he prescribes forgiveness as a blanket "You need to forgive them so Satan doesn't have a ground to attack you".  Yet to go by Mark and Grace Driscoll's statements in Win Your War and comments from people who have left The Trinity Church the Driscolls seem to still experience what they regard as spiritual attacks. As I've discussed in the past looking at Judges 9 and the afflicting spirit the Lord sent to King Saul in the Hebrew Bible we don't even find "demons" as conventionally understood from medieval European Christian diabology moving forward--instead we find the Lord occasionally sent spirits to afflict corrupt, self-serving and wicked leaders to torment them or deceive their prophets.  

This is a commonplace element in the Hebrew Bible when it comes to leaders being afflicted by the Lord for abuse or misappropriation of power but in the Driscolls' writings they chalk up any spiritual attacks they face to "intense seasons of ministry". The possibility that they opened themselves up to spiritual torment because of their abuses and injustices has,  to the best of my knowledge, literally never come up once in their twenty years of being public ministry figures together.  If Mark doesn't publicly confess he wronged people and leans on a forgiveness doctrine that functionally works as apotropaic magic the purpose of forgiveness may no longer even be about relational reconciliation or repentance at all in any Christian sense of the term, but a kind of protective spell-casting that is expected to protect the person who prays from being attacked).  

Sunday, August 28, 2022

some thoughts on the Cosper interview with Allender, this is one of the episodes I think is both focused and helpful even if I remain ambivalent about the series overall

https://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/podcasts/rise-and-fall-of-mars-hill/bonus-episode-conversation-with-dan-allender.html

Yes, by implication I've suggested that some of the CT episodes of The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill were neither focused nor helpful across the series as a whole by giving this post the title it has.  The new Allender episode, however, is one of the strongest in the entire series because it is shorter than average and by dint of having one subject who is recognized as an expert in counseling within evangelicalism the episode stays remarkably on focus.